The Internet is a weird and wonderful place. You Tube especially. You Tube appears to be the place to find the extremes of the human condition. You can find the best in people and laugh along with Double Rainbow Guy, Trololo Man, Baby Porcupine Eating Banana with Hiccups and where would be without Maru the box stalking cat?
But YouTube has a dark side and sometimes the darker side of humanity can be found there too. Many of us have stumbled upon it accidentally. For me, it’s innocently looking up rabbit videos and then the next thing you see in the suggested videos are people feeding live rabbits to their pet snake (who laugh about it). But it even gets darker.
Several months back, Mike McDowell brought to my attention that there were several videos of people shooting birds–not duck hunting, but people (kids and adults alike) shooting swallows, woodpeckers, herons, brown thrashers, cardinals–you name it. Then putting the videos on YouTube. Mike expressed his frustration that YouTube would not take the videos down, even though they were in blatant violation of federal law.
The idea of blogging this was kicked around and I suggested that we wait. Perhaps US Fish and Wildlife was doing an investigation and if we blogged it, the people might take down their videos and interfere with the legal process. Mike had even tried asking YouTube to remove the videos since they showed blatant illegal activity, but YouTube ignored his flagging.
I sent some emails to US Fish and Wildlife along with links (follow the links at your own risk) to videos including a video of a kid shooting what appears to be cliff swallows (documented by his dad), a video of a someone shooting a mockingbird, a video of someone shooting a yellow-rumped warbler. This is just the tip of the iceberg. If you have the stomach for it, you can easily find more. Including birds that have been shot and the person asking what they are because they don’t know that they’ve shot white-throated sparrows (and given the wrong id information about the birds in the comment section).
Here was the answer I received from US Fish and Wildlife:
“Two of the three, and possibly all three of these videos show only evidence of children shooting birds. The Federal government does not prosecute juveniles, except for the most heinous of crimes. Lot’s of these types videos floating around the web and not enough agents. Took us several months and hundreds of investigative hours (including numerous interrogations and lab work) to catch the whooping crane shooter, only to discover DOJ would not prosecute the juvenile shooter (he was 17). Some of our agents do pursue these types of investigations when time allows. Thanks for passing along.”
Wow, who knew they found the whooping crane shooter? All I ever saw was the reward going up and up, never heard anyone was apprehended. Guess because it was a juvenile, they wanted to keep it on the down low. But shouldn’t a juvenile get some some sort of consequences?
The response read to me that the enforcement employee was just as frustrated as I am. They know there is a problem, there’s not enough man power to deal with the Internet and even if they could, kids would be ignored.
So, what can we do? I don’t think leaving comments on the videos telling them they are illegal jerks (or whatever profanity you choose) for posting this will do anything but reinforce the behavior.
I do think if YouTube got more flagging and complaints about these videos, they might be more willing to remove them quickly.
I do not think blaming US Fish and Wildlife agents is the answer either. They have a tremendous job as it is. They would like to do more, but by the above response, their hands are tied, regardless of what the federal law states.
But I think a deeper problem exists here. We hear lots of complaints about the kids not spending enough time in the outdoors and here we have several kids outdoors but not seeing the value wildlife other than being moving, noisy targets.
I think if anything, this is one of those opportunities where hunters and birders need to work together. I know many birders don’t want anything to do with hunting, but true hunters do not condone wanton shooting of any living creature. These kids need a good and responsible hunting role model and someone who won’t judge them for hunting yet can show them the value of going out in the woods and enjoying birds in a different way.
What else can we do to stop this problem and help US Fish and Wildlife?
Why aren’t the parents of the shooters being prosecuted for contributing to the delinquency of a minor? Certainly filming and cheering on the commission of a federal crime seems like it would fall in that category.
And I’m not clear on why the kids can’t be prosecuted. Certainly some under-18s are prosecuted for drug charges, breaking-and-entering, theft etc.
What erika said. The Whooping Crane situation is completely different, because it wasn’t a video, right? These seem like a slam dunks in comparison. Subpeona YouTube to give up IP addresses and you can nail these people.
Didn’t local authorities get those guys who made a video shooting Grebes in the not too distant past?
Have to say, I’m pretty disappointed with the Fed’s response here.
We, as birders, are not going to stop this. We can only try to prevent it from happening in the future.
You are correct to say “But I think a deeper problem exists here.” The problem lies with our society and what it values, and that is not going to be changed easily or anytime soon for that matter.
The Feds are not going to spend time and money trying to investigate and prosecute the makers of these videos, as it does not rank high up on mainstream America’s ‘priorities’. Same goes with YouTube, not a high enough priority for them.
Education/outreach is our best chance at making progress. I have seen some wonderful progress/success with the young birder’s clubs. We should try to reach out to local schools, as many youth would probably not be exposed to the world of nature otherwise. Joining forces with hunting clubs and hunters is a good idea. Hunting is usually passed down through the family, so the kids will act and behave as they see their parents do.
A while back, maybe a year or two ago, there was a video post on youtube of two male juveniles torturing, and beating a gray male feline. At first youtube did not act, but once the video circulated, and people on the internet (I believe that in this case some one recognized one of the juveniles) got involved, local authorities apprehended the young boys and charged them.
Just because they are juveniles does not mean that they can’t be punished some how, even if that “punishment” are classes that teach the children that you respect nature, ect.
I know in cases of vandalism on Air Force bases the parents were held responsible for the children’s behavior. In the videos where parents cheer on the children, or “give them permission to shoot the birds” the parents should be held accountable in some way. Some times you have to enforce the law in order for people to respect the law.
I’m not sure getting a subpoena for each IP address and chasing these people down really solves the problem. In the first place, this gets into the argument of internet privacy, which is a whole different can of worms – even in cases in which hunting someone down because of an internet post is legal, it tends to draw negative press. More importantly, chasing people down all over the country involves a lot of work hours. As the Fish and Wildlife rep said, “not enough agents.” I can see where, for example, that issues regarding endangered species would be a higher priority for them. A kid shooting a cardinal while his dad films it is pretty gross to me, but then, I can see why it’s less of a priority in a job where you do have to choose your battles based on the resources you have.
Also, I don’t think people are shooting birds because they want to post it to YouTube. I think they’d be shooting them no matter what. At that point, to me the question is what would I do if my neighbor was letting his kid shoot birds? I don’t think I’d call the feds. I’d probably find a way to let him know that it’s a crime, but do it privately and in a way that he understands that I’m just concerned.
The neocons have gutted our govt services and swamped this country with guns. People no longer hunt for food, they hunt for a quick ego trip. Our schools never teach the students about endangered species or the destruction of the environment but the religious fanatics are allowed to protest scientific discoveries like creation go figure
oops should read evolution
I think teaching kids to appreciate their environment is the key. It can start in your own backyard with your neighbors and children’s friends. And, I agree we should do more in school. I would like to share what has happened in my own cul de sac. We had a productive owl’s nest this year in the neighbor’s yard. We loved watching it and seeing the owlet as it developed and left the nest. Our neighbnor’s did not appreciate the hooting at night and one suggested shooting it. I told our most vocal neighbor that it was illegal and she spread the word as I knew she would. The owls are safe and the complaining has stopped. So; we can do something in our own piece of the world.
Gayle
you had no right using my videos on your website plus them little ugly feather ball eat and terrorize my property it called pest control just like killing mice and ants so you might want to take my video off and just so you know an alliance is being formed against you fucker so go give a chicken a blow job
1. I linked to it, I did not use it on my site. Legal.
2. If you do not want people linking to your videos, do not make them public.
3. If you continue with that sort of threatening language and illegal killing of birds, your isp address and email and contact information will be turned over to the Minneapolis Police Department and the Department of the Interior.
Another edumicated troll- of the bird-killing persuasion. Get a clue, dumbass.
Sad and demoralizing. But thank you for looking into this and letting us know the outcome. Animal cruelty is animal cruely, no matter the species and studies show that people who torture animals as children are perpetrators or violence against people when they are adults.